Each May, the Audio Publishers Association holds its annual conference (APAC) in New York City. I attended two years ago and can testify that it is a wonderful place for those in the industry to catch up with one another and network. There are numerous panels and workshops to attend that are rather short in length but there is just so much in the industry to cover that more just isn’t possible.
This past May, Johnny Heller hosted a narrators workshop the day before APAC, allowing for a longer event (9:30 – 4:30). Aptly titled Johnny Heller’s All Star Narrator Workshop (I think – no wait, it was actually the 1st Annual Johnny Heller Splendiforous Slambang Audiobook Workshop/Celebration Thingamabob), it featured a number of panels and coaching sessions led by Scott Brick, Simon Vance, Robert Fass, Karen White, Carol Monda, Peter Berkrot, PJ Ochlan, Jeffrey Kafer, and, of course, Johnny Heller.
Karen White had discussed romance narrations at length with the AudioGals reviewers prior to the event as she prepared a romance presentation along with Carol Monda and Jeffrey Kafer. Apparently the workshop was a huge success and Karen had a lot to share with us – so much in fact that I felt it highly worthy of an AudioGals chat.
And as we chatted, I realized we were essentially talking about the basics of romance narration and what we as listeners want and need to hear. Therefore – the primary title for this chat shifted from Chatting with Karen White About May’s Narrator Workshop to A Primer for Narrating Romance as that better describes this particular chat although the workshop covered all genres.
Chatting with Karen
LEA Hi Karen. Welcome back to AudioGals!
KAREN Thanks, I feel like I’ve been here quite a few times this year, so thanks for having me yet again!
LEA You always have great things to share.
KAREN Thank you. I do love to chat audiobooks. I’m just now happily remembering hanging out with you and talking endlessly about them (as well as a few other things) at RWA in San Antonio a year ago.
LEA Can you believe that was a year ago? I so enjoyed working with you on that presentation and just visiting when we were able to take a break. A good time although WOW, hot!
KAREN Oh, yes it was hard to keep the professional look walking through 100 degree heat to the conference.
LEA Uhh, yeah!!
LEA We’re interested in knowing more about a narrator’s workshop you participated in this last May right before APAC. Can you give us an overview?
KAREN Well, narrator and voice-over coach Johnny Heller thought it might be a good idea to take advantage of so many narrators being in New York at one time for APAC and put together a positive learning experience for narrators who aren’t brand spankin’ new, but who have been working for a relatively short time, perhaps mostly through ACX, and are just starting to break in to the major publishing market. APAC is a great conference for networking, and one can learn some useful things, but it’s hard to cover topics for the wide variety of narrators that attend.
KAREN Johnny put together a panel of experienced narrators, including myself, to be the “coaches” and more than eighty people signed up pretty quickly!
KAREN We were all together in one big room, so Johnny had each first give some “wise words” or “deep thoughts” talk about what we were passionate about as narrators. Then we each had assigned topics to talk about for a bit (mine were Social Media and Romance) and then in the afternoon each coach worked for twelve minutes (exactly!) with an individual narrator in front of the group.
KAREN It WAS a very positive experience and I think we all learned a great deal and were buoyed by the sense of community and desire to produce good work.
LEA To give our readers a better idea of the scope of this workshop, I’m including the schedule here:
BREAKING DOWN THE SCENE – ACTING ADVICE – Peter Berkrot
WEBSITES/SOCIAL MEDIA – Scott Brick
ACX AND THE EXPERIENCED NARRATOR – Jeffrey Kafer & Jason Ojalvo
ROMANCE /EROTICA – Karen White, Carol Monda & Jeffrey Kafer
ONE-ON-ONE AND/OR GROUP DIRECTION ON COPY – Johnny Heller, Scott Brick, Peter Berkrot, Carol Monda, Jeffrey Kater, PJ Ochlan, Karen White, Robert Fass, & Simon Vance
NON FICTION – Robert Fass
CHARACTER PRESENTATION – PJ Ochlan
LEA I was so pleased to see Romance garner a spot in the workshop.
KAREN Well, yes, people realize that it is a huge genre.
KAREN As you know, I polled your reviewers to get their pet peeves and wish lists for newer narrators and you all gave me a lot to work with.
LEA I saw your summary! In my Calibre size 14 font, it was ten pages of thoughts from our AudioGals reviewers.
LEA We do like to think we know what we are talking about. :)
KAREN And so much of what your reviewers talked about is applicable to all narration, I think.
KAREN The first thing I said to the group was that if you are not going to take this genre seriously and treat it with the same respect as any other, you should NOT take the work, because the listeners can hear that disrespect!
LEA I saw your comment about taking the genre seriously on Karen Commins’ blog and I believe you easily got that feeling from us. Disregard for the genre can come off as an insult to the listener. It is almost an intangible but we DO hear it!
KAREN If one does this for a living, one is going to encounter a wide range of writing skill, no matter the genre. And part of the job is elevating the less skilled writing as much as possible and not ruining the really good writing! But for whatever reason, people just assume romance writing is all the same and bad writing. I confess that I thought that, too, at one time. Before I read a Julie James book, that is
LEA I thought it once too Karen. I didn’t start reading romance until 2000 – I was actually a sort of snob when it came to reading.
KAREN So, I did talk to the narrators about some thing that were particular to the romance genre, like not only differentiating the characters clearly, but figuring out how to make your opposite gender characters “feel” like men (or women, depending on your own gender) even if you can’t sound exactly like a man.
KAREN And there was fun stuff on narrating intimate scenes.
LEA Those intimate scenes are part of your job but even we love to see the fun side of all that since some of us have a hard time with those intimate scenes!
KAREN I read this comment by Kaetrin aloud and it got a huge laugh (but I hope they got the point):
KAREN “I want believable emotion in the listen, not just in the dialogue but in the narrative. Subtle tends to work better than overdone – the text does a lot of the work. But I listened to an audiobook last week which I found really boring and part of it was that the narrator sounded so flat during the numerous sex scenes. Seriously, she’d say “I’m coming” (something the character said A LOT) like a bored McDonalds worker saying “here’s your order”. It wasn’t passionate or emotional or engaging and it put me off.”
LEA Kaetrin does have a way about saying things.
KAREN But the other end of the spectrum is when a narrator gets too vocally involved, as Melinda says:
KAREN “Please keep the bedroom fiction low key, or at least lower key than full bore ‘I’m actually in the bedroom watching you’ level. I can use my imagination even if the narrator is subtle.”
KAREN To me, the key to narrating an intimate scene is to focus on playing the action between the characters. For actors, this means that each thing a characters says is part of getting what they want emotionally from the other character. And the more specific you are about what the character wants, the more real it sounds. This allows the subtext (what he or she is really saying underneath the words) to come out in the dialogue. And, what the characters are feeling drives the dialogue as well as the narrative. The author may give you hints as to what the character’s subtext is with their inner monologue or with an attributive, but sometimes you have to make it up. Finally, I try to keep the emotions as real as possible and I think that keeps the result from feeling, uh, Peeping Tom-ish.
LEA Well, you have it there. I couldn’t articulate that sense of keeping the emotions real if I tried but you just nailed it.
KAREN Thank you! It also makes it more fun and less… weird…to be acting out these scenes all by oneself. Or with a 20 year old engineer!
LEA What were some of the other topics covered in the romance presentation?
KAREN I think the rest of the issues you all raised are applicable to all audiobook narration, actually, and I’ve seen them in other posts. Things like wooden narrative vs. over-acted narrative, pacing, distracting breaths, poorly performed accents. And something which boggles my mind – not paying attention to specific dialogue tags! That’s the simplest thing. If the writer say, “she answered primly”, then that tells you how to say it!
LEA Oh, I like this!
LEA That’s very critical when I’m listening. Don’t go wooden or all sunshine on the narrative.
KAREN But the other things are tricky to find by yourself, or even with a director if the director doesn’t know how to speak “actor language”.
KAREN Finding the tone of the narrative is about a few things – reading the script carefully and then using whatever experience you have to understand what the writer’s “voice” or “tone” is so that you can embody it. And then being as in the moment as possible when you’re recording.
KAREN But both of those things require a LOT of practice and/or very good guidance from directors and coaches.
KAREN If it’s first person, it’s pretty easy to understand that you are telling the story from that person’s POV and you should allow how they feel about the story to infuse the telling of it.
KAREN But in third person, you have to figure out how much to infuse the narrative with that kind of emotion. Scott Brick articulated it in terms of three levels.
KAREN The first was the “eye of God”, I believe he called it. Where the narrator sees all but is distant from what’s going on. That would lead the actor to be more dispassionate.
KAREN Then the second is where the narrator knows what the characters are thinking. Then the narrative voice is a little more involved.
KAREN But there’s third person narrative where the narrator knows what all the characters are feeling, too. Which happens a lot in romance titles. And that narration just demands that you deliver it with those feelings.
KAREN What’s clear is that you have to treat the narrative voice like another character and fully understand what that character’s relationship to the story and the characters is. And it might shift over the course of the story, too!
LEA Since I have written about romance audio for years now, I probably know the intricacies of what does and doesn’t work best for the listener (although we all have different tastes) and I have thought a lot about the challenges of narrating romance.
LEA I think romance listeners demand more and maybe it is that third level you just mentioned. We want to hear all of that emotion. And it makes me wonder – do we, in fact, demand more from a narrator?
LEA Even if the emotion is ever so subtle – we need to hear subtle.
KAREN I think it’s a combination of being discerning (a nicer way of saying demanding, I think) and being vocal about what you want. How healthy!
KAREN There are listeners who will listen to a computerized voice or a bunch of different volunteer voices narrate a single book because it’s free.
KAREN But for the discerning listener like you, a performance that “gets” the genre and the individual writer’s style seems important. The narrator needs to know whether the choices SHOULD be theatrical and broad or SHOULD be subtle. For some narrators it seems to be instinctive, for others it seems to take a lot of direction. Good instincts plus good direction seems to be a good combo, at least to start off well.
That said, I think we all connect more easily with some writers than others – and you all can tell when that match is good. It feels to us and it sounds to you like the performer’s voice IS the writer’s voice. When I record a Jill Shalvis book, I feel like I am so funny. Like I am making it up as I go, because for whatever reason I get her sense of humor and way of telling a story. But for other writers I have to work a bit more to find the narrative style (which means that sometimes its trial and error and I end up re-recording the first chapter).
LEA Approximately 50% of my listening time is spent with general fiction or non-fiction. I listen a LOT so it still allows me a good amount of time for romance listening. I actually appreciate romance more when I’m mixing it up like that.
KAREN For us, too, I think getting to narrate different genres is informative. When I narrate fantasy and get to voice a dragon, or do a cozy mystery and have to populate a whole town with crazy characters, that gives me a chance to play around with new things.
KAREN And the challenge of narrating non-fiction is that you REALLY have to make that author’s voice your own because that’s all there is.
LEA I can see that entirely.
LEA But here is another question I’ve wanted to pose (that works in perfectly with today’s chat) – do we as romance listeners require more differentiation of male and female characters? I’m not near as picky about this when I’m listening to general fiction. I still want to know if it is a man or woman speaking but I don’t really mind if a male narrator goes high for a female character as I would with romance.
KAREN Most listeners want differentiation because they don’t want to be distracted by wondering who is speaking.
LEA I’m okay with just a general differentiation – but I don’t require the detailed personality traits of the hero or heroine as I do in romance.
KAREN But I do think romance listeners, more than others, want to FEEL like the hero and heroine are believable.
KAREN And that means that a man FEELS like a man and a woman FEELS like a woman.
LEA And THIS is why you are so effective at narrating romance! It’s all about portraying feeling and I guess that leads back to your first romance observation in the workshop of respecting romance as we feel the disrespect?! That FEELS sorta personal.
LEA But when it comes right down to it, I just don’t require the same engagement of characters from the narrator in a John Grisham book as I do in a Julie James.
KAREN Do you think it’s also because you read/listen to romance for the emotional journey? And if the hero and heroine don’t go on that in a believable way then it detracts from the experience?
LEA I do, in fact. And I have been wanting to feature that possibility in a larger arena than just my mind! I honestly don’t know how a brand new narrator can pull off an effective romance narration unless possibly they are romance fans themselves (in the truest sense of the word – meaning romance GENRE – not a book someone thinks is romantic).
KAREN A new narrator should at the least study the genre before narrating it. All of them, really. But they don’t always teach romance in college lit courses
LEA We understand most clearly that there is a lot of misperception out there about the romance genre. The belief is that it’s all formula or sex or crying emotion. Or, heaven help us – brainless! But that judgment comes from NON-romance readers – those who have never given the genre a serious try. Oh, there is junk in the genre just as with any genre but there are extremely well written dramatic or funny or psychologically deep or otherworldly romances everywhere. Okay – that’s leading up to this…
LEA Since I have your undivided attention…
LEA Romances have hopeful endings – look anywhere – the Romance Writers Association or other representative groups and you will hear that the happily-ever-after or hopeful ending is a requirement. The hero or heroine doesn’t die. They may go through some major trials and separations but on that last page, they are together. Romance readers love the guarantee of an eventual happy ending. It’s the reason I can mix romance so effectively with non-fiction and general fiction. So, we romance listeners have a BIG complaint. Someone in the audio publishing industry just doesn’t understand the romance industry. Otherwise, why would Bridges of Madison County even be a finalist for a Romance Audie much less the winner?!
KAREN We may need a petition to go to the Audies committee!
LEA The hero dies before the end of the book! The protagonists aren’t even together all that much in terms of years and the ultimate romance sin (beside the whole unhappy ending thing) is NO adultery for the leads. How’s that for old fashioned? But that’s romance.
LEA And worst of all, for the larger audio industry? It means dedicated romance narrators have less of a chance of winning an Audie in the romance category when the Audies committee insists on including non-romance titles as finalists. And it happens year after year.
KAREN That is an excellent point.
LEA Whew – bottled up a little since the Audies…
KAREN Yes, and to get back to the narrator’s job, here’s my thought: I think there is a fantasy element in romance, but one that has to be respected. Of course life doesn’t have HEA – the real ending is that we all die eventually! But obviously there is a desire for this fantasy of the HEA among listeners. And the respect means that you don’t think, “Oh, Romance, it’s not real, so I should act like I’m in a Soap Opera.” Instead, you understand what in theatre would be called “The World of the Play” and you make everything you do as believable as possible within that world. Which, technically you should do if you’re acting in a Soap Opera, as well, but that’s a different rant.
LEA There! Perfect!
LEA We need emotion and fantasy but we also buy a LOT of romance audios.
KAREN EVERY audiobook has its own acting challenge. You just have to understand what that challenge is.
KAREN And to get back to the male/female character thing. There are technical, vocal things that people do to make themselves sound like the opposite genre.
KAREN For women to make male voices, you can add texture and/or place it in the chest resonator. But you have to be careful not to push it down or you’ll damage your voice.
KAREN And for men I’ve heard that “lightening” the sound helps, also placing it more in the face, rather than thinking of just raising the notes.
LEA Both are clearly very effective for me as a listener.
KAREN But I really think that you have to embrace THINKING like that individual person and that’s what really sells it. When I did my first romance, I kind of had my generic cocky frat guy voice and I think you can hear that it’s general.
LEA It’s definitely effective differentiation but once you are past that, it’s also all about attitude – however a narrator feeds that into the romantic leads – it’s what we have been talking about.
KAREN What I heard from this workshop in particular is that these narrators want to do a good job, and they are willing to work on it. Hopefully we gave them more to go on than simple trial and error.
KAREN So many new narrators are having to develop their craft while self-directing. And they are taking classes, but sometimes that means just a few hours of coaching, and what they take away are general ideas.
KAREN So I HOPE that the ones who do want to succeed in this genre had some SPECIFIC takeaways to apply.
KAREN Oh, and when we figured out that Jeffrey Kafer had narrated at least as many romance titles as I have, I do think that was an eye opener for the male narrators in the room.
LEA He does know his craft!
LEA Two years ago when I attended APAC (and was part of the panel you moderated), I had the sense that many of the males in the audience were surprised when I stated that romance listeners want more male narrators. Did you see evidence that more are open to narrating romance?
LEA I admit that it is a woman’s genre for the most part, but that also means women appreciate a male’s well-executed performance of a love story especially if there is a strong male POV.
KAREN I didn’t get questions from any man, but there was the sense that it’s a pleasant surprise. Honestly, most actors are always happy to hear about more opportunities to work!
LEA Are there any other details you’d like to share with us either about this workshop or APAC in general?
KAREN There are always more topics to talk about – pacing, breathing and turning down work when you think you can’t do a good job all came up at the workshop. Being present, or “in the moment” was a shared value for most of the coaches on the dais. As well as finding a way to personally connect to the text, as well as to the listener when you’re recording. For every book, there is someone out there who needs to hear it, and the narrator has to keep that in mind when working, and tell the story for that person. Hopefully there’s more than one!
KAREN My takeaway from the day was that we can learn a lot from each other – narrators can learn from what listeners want. I got so much from reading what your reviewers had to say as I prepared for the workshop. Then I learned from my fellow coaches and from questions that the students asked. And I hope that your listeners can learn from discussions like these!
LEA Since there is a significant amount of content from the Narrators Workshop that we did not cover today, what do you think about joining me here again in September so we can continue the discussion?
KAREN Sure, I’d love to talk more about narration technique with you!
I’d love to hear if there are topics that your readers want to hear more about, but three that I can think of (and we may be moving beyond this particular workshop here, but these are items that come up a lot): pacing, breathing and enunciation.
LEA Then it’s a date! Thanks for joining us today and for the promise of returning again soon.
Ending Notes
Readers/listeners – are there romance narration topics you would like to see discussed in one of these chats?
For more about Johnny Heller’s All Star Narrator Workshop, visit Karen Commins’ blog for a great overview of the workshop – Ten Takeaways from Johnny Heller’s All-Star Narrator Workshop.
Thanks to Karen for visiting with us today and her unwavering efforts to spread the word about quality romance narrations!
Lea Hensley
Fantastic interview. Karen White is a great narrator and a wonderful person! I have benefitted so much from being her colleague and I am always so happy to hear what’s on her mind. She is one of the very best.
Thanks, Kathe! That is truly and honor coming from you.
Thanks Kathe for stopping by! I have participated in two outside events with Karen as well as numerous joint events at AudioGals and Speaking of Audiobooks. She IS one of the very best – to work with and to listen to.
Great interview!
Thanks, Jonetta!
I was so sorry to have missed last year’s APAC – thanks for filling me in on these important points. I’m already looking forward to Chicago next May.
Hey Andi – good to hear from you. So, is APAC in Chicago next year? That’s easier traveling for this Oklahoman.
Great interview, both of you! I was really bummed to miss APAC this year, and especially Johnny’s event. I’m glad to learn some of the points that were covered, and Lea, your questions were spot-on to bring out the best information. Of course, Karen is da bomb. Thanks for doing this interview.
Thank you, Ann!
Thanks Ann! Good to see you here. :)
Greetings, Lea, Karen, and Audio Gals! Thanks for this terrific, in-depth interview! I also appreciate the link to my blog post where I outlined 10 takeaways from Johnny Heller’s narrator workshop.
For what it’s worth, the actual title of the workshop was the “1st Annual Johnny Heller Splendiforous Slambang Audiobook Workshop/Celebration Thingamabob.” However, to fit the theme of my article and fit the title on my blog page, I referred to it as “Johnny Heller’s All Star Narrator Workshop”. :)
Since you requested future discussion topics, I’d like to see a panel about how romance reviewers’ interpretations of the text influence their expectations for what they consider a quality listening experience.
I don’t know a single narrator who doesn’t give their all when voicing a book. We WANT to make good acting choices that serve the text. We WANT to take the listeners on an emotional journey. We WANT the listener to be satisfied with our performance and enjoy our way of telling the story.
Lea said:
“I think romance listeners demand more and maybe it is that third level you just mentioned. We want to hear all of that emotion. And it makes me wonder – do we, in fact, demand more from a narrator?”
With all due respect and in complete sincerity, I’ve noticed and other narrators have said to me that romance listeners tend to be the harshest critics of narration. Whether on a blog, in Goodreads threads, or in Audible comments, romance listeners often express very rigid ideas about the (only) way a book should be performed.
Audiobook narration is a performance art that is based on the narrator’s interpretation of the author’s words. However, the comments and reviews I’ve seen indicate that, unlike listeners in other genres, many romance listeners have already read the printed book — sometimes more than once — and expect the narrator’s interpretation to flawlessly match the one they heard in their head.
Even when the story is new to them, if the narrator’s interpretation doesn’t match the listener’s or makes different choices, the narrator is at fault. The resulting review can be quite brutal.
Listeners of other genres seem to have more relaxed views about the narration. Sure, they dislike certain narrators and/or books. They tend to state their opinions, noting with varying degrees of specificity their views about the level or lack of excellence in narration, and move on to the next audiobook. When reading comments about other genres, I haven’t felt like those listeners were actively campaigning against a narrator.
It seems that a romance listener has something more at stake than his/her enjoyment of an audiobook. When a romance listener is disappointed by an audiobook, she often actively warns off potential listeners and advises them to return books they don’t like to send a message to the publisher about a so-called bad narrator.
I’ve been surprised to read critiques about a narrator of a romance book that were more scathing than those in a debate about politics or religion. I’ve seen romance listeners bash narrators as though the narrator killed their puppy. I come away from such discussions and reviews thinking, “it’s just an audiobook.”
In any genre but perhaps especially so with romance, narrators worry that the sharpest listener comments and reviews will negatively affect their relationships and future contracts with publishers and authors.
Given the frequency and intensity of these types of comments and reviews from romance listeners, I admit that I am bit reluctant to undertake a romance book, much less send it to a romance reviewer.
Are narrators completely missing the fantasy element in romance that Karen mentioned in the interview? Are romance reviewers open-minded when they listen to a book? A panel that discusses a romance listener’s emotional needs from and expectations for an audiobook would be highly informative!
Like Lea’s remarks above about THE BRIDGES OF MADISON COUNTY, I have had these feelings and concerns bottled up and am grateful for the opportunity to suggest the topic for future discussion. Throughout my life, I’ve found that I may be the one who brings up the issue, but I am also speaking up for others who can’t or won’t speak for themselves.
PS. Congrats to Karen White for winning another AudioFile Magazine Earphones Award just this morning for her narration of SUDDENLY ONE SUMMER by Julie James! The reviewer wrote: “Her performance especially shines in her perfectly timed delivery of the sexual intensity between Dixon and Spade.” (thus proving Karen’s point in the interview “the key to narrating an intimate scene is to focus on playing the action between the characters. “)
Cordially,
Karen Commins
Karen – thanks for the use of your workshop title! I saw more than one title and didn’t know if Johnny’s “1st Annual Johnny Heller Splendiforous Slambang Audiobook Workshop/Celebration Thingamabob” was a joke or the real thing so I just went with an “I think.” :)
And thank you for your suggestion of a future topic addressing the issue of “how romance reviewers’ interpretations of the text influence their expectations for what they consider a quality listening experience.”
I have read over your post a number of times attempting to see through what appears to be a gross generalization of romance listeners as a whole (and reviewers as well). I assure you we aren’t the beasts you paint us to be! Oh, there are groups that criticize unfairly one narrator or another – I admit that. But we find that the majority of listeners are accepting of most narrators if the narrator has the training/talent/experience to pull off the art of narration – one of the most difficult acting gigs around.
Our job at AudioGals is to find those narrators who are exceptional at their craft and give them praise for it. Fortunately we have a long list of narrators we can recommend with enthusiasm as they do, in fact, “get” romance (although there are some who will argue that narrating romance is like narrating any other genre). From them, we hear the author’s descriptions of feelings and emotion. From my chat with Karen yesterday, you can see that I am one who does feel that romance listeners demand a bit more from narrators and I’ll add to that…
I don’t believe the romance genre is the place for a new narrator to start in the business and I say that being fully aware that it provides many with the opportunity to enter the business. But when a romance listener discovers a narrator who does work for them? You’ll find that loyalty to that narrator usually follows. We’re always looking for yet another narrator to add to our internal “trusted narrators” list. It provides us with a much larger choice of audios to buy with confidence.
But hey – I’m only one listener and there are many differing opinions about genre versus difficulty of narration. Making generalizations about romance genre listeners is a little like herding cats! And you don’t even hear from the vast majority who buy the audios.
I don’t know if you are familiar with our site but we insist that our reviewers state the reason(s) why a narration doesn’t work for them if, in fact, it doesn’t. We give far more B grades (above average) and higher than not. A well written negative review can attract listeners to an audiobook as well if the reasons for the poorer grade are explained because there’s one thing we are absolutely certain of – ALL listeners hear things differently. If one likes a narrator’s style, it doesn’t guarantee that the reviewer next in line will. It is a personal matter and one we have seen again and again. And if a reviewer doesn’t explain why a narrator is receiving a lower grade (no “I can’t stand this narrator” reasoning allowed), the review doesn’t get published.
I regret that you have had such a negative experience with romance listeners (I assume you have narrated a number of romances). There are many (and I imagine most) of us who are open to newer talent – we truly are! We’ll see if our next chat can cover a bit more the expectations of romance listeners although I think this chat was quite effective at relaying just that.
The commenter says: “It seems that a romance listener has something more at stake than his/her enjoyment of an audiobook.” and all I can think is, is she serious? No, I’m pretty sure that all audiobook listeners, including those of us who enjoy the Romance genre, only have One Audiobook Credit at stake. We want to enjoy a book and feel it was Worth a Credit, even if we got it free at the library. smh
Thanks Lea for your reply to KC. Her generalizations made me so mad that I didn’t think I could articulate my opinion graciously. I am always flummoxed when people come to a “romance based blog” and bitch about the genre and it’s readers.
I will add that I have very high expectations about the quality of a narrator……NO MATTER THE GENRE!
You know? I do have high expectations of the narrator no matter the genre but I guess it’s okay with me if an otherwise excellent narrator of a general fiction title doesn’t get a possible romance (within those pages) completely right. It’s something I have puzzled over. Maybe it’s the fact that I don’t expect the romance to be the main event in the book?
BUT, if there aren’t easily distinguishable characters or, if the general narrative doesn’t match the content (as Karen puts it “wooden narrative vs. over-acted narrative”) or if I hear those distracting breaths, I don’t care how great the author or the narrator – I stop listening. If I’m interested in continuing with the book, I read it.
Mel: *like* your comment (need a like button!!)
I’m a demanding consumer of anything. If I buy a fridge, I expect it to do a good job of keeping my food cold, if I buy a TV I’m looking for a great picture and if I buy a meal, I’m looking for tasty food cooked well.
When I buy an audiobook I’m not only spending money, I’m investing my *time*. And my time is valuable. If I feel a narrator is wasting my time by a lacklustre performance, then I will say so and I’m unlikely to want to repeat the experience. If I find the narrator meets or exceeds my expectations of an entertaining listening experience, then I will sing his or her praises until the cows come home and, very often, I will choose a new-to-me author on the strength of who the narrator is.
There are some narrators who are very talented but who don’t work for me. I don’t review their work once I work it out and I am careful to say that this is a case of “it’s me not you” so that readers of the review can note that my dissatisfaction is a personal thing which is nothing to do with talent or skill. There are just some voices I find unpleasant to my ear – but which others love and with are otherwise wonderful narrators. There are narrators I love that other reviewers here do not and vice versa, so definitely personal taste plays a part.
When I review print books, I try to keep it about the text. However, when reviewing an audiobook, reviewing the book/content is only one part. Necessarily the reviewer has to review the narrator’s performance and this *is* personal. I can see that it’s perhaps a little more difficult for a narrator to separate her/himself from the performance whereas it may be a little easier for an author to separate herself from the text (though not always!) That said, our “job” as reviewers is for the listeners and we must therefore be honest even if that may come across as “mean”.
Hi Karen,
Thanks for the kudos regarding my Earphones Award. I was very excited to receive it and it was nice of you to highlight it.
I have to disagree with a number of your points, however. It seems that you’ve had a bad experience or two with romance listeners. But I would argue that I’ve seen narrators who are beloved by many (Scott Brick is just one example) get pilloried by other listeners who can’t express in enough ways how much they *hate* him and his work. I’m not as popular as Scott, but I’ve been under attack quite a few times myself. I learned awhile ago to simply avoid reading listener reviews on Amazon, because those folks seem to have few filters, seem primarily motivated to vent their ire, and rarely offer constructive criticism.
The romance reviewers I follow, on the other hand, (including AudioGals) have actually been responsible for changing my approach. Lea and others on this blog complained that my work lacked sufficient differentiation, and that my heroes in particular lacked dimension. My background at Books-on-Tape directed me toward minimal characterization in adult fiction, but it seemed clear that times were changing and romance listeners (and now, honestly, many listeners across the board) want to hear a fuller performance. A one-woman-show rather than the experience of being read to.
I’ve also made changes to my pacing and worked hard to be more present in response to listener feedback. Having a good director is all well and good, but she is only one listener. Since I’m not performing for a live audience, I have had to figure out how to use comments and reviews in a way that works for me. Which means not taking it personally and looking for trends that seem to make sense rather than reacting to one person’s mean rant.
On some level, I get your concern that publishers and producers are watching those rating stars and your hire-ability may take a dive due to bad comments. But that’s not been my experience. I’ve found that reliability and lack of drama, as well as a clean, high quality product seems to keep employers coming back for more. There is a level of subjectivity that you simply can’t second guess – and you can’t please everyone. There are some producers who hire me again and again and some who I can’t even get to return my emails. I can’t control that. It’s become a competitive field and I feel lucky to work as much as I do, but it hasn’t always been the case for me. It took more than 10 years for me to get to the point of working full time. Some newer narrators have been able to catapult to that level of work quickly, but I think they are in the minority.
Finally, from my POV, our industry has historically not taken the romance genre very seriously (nor is it well understood as evidenced by what makes it to Audie Finalist status). For some time, romance books were paid at a lower rate than other books at one publisher under an AFTRA contract (until we pushed for that to change). Many publishers have (at least in the past) used the romance genre to try out new narrators. Perhaps they either think it’s “easier” or they don’t think the listeners will notice. I’m not sure. But I am sure that budget is part of their decision making process.
But I think what Vicky (Lea) and I have tried to articulate is that romance listeners, just like the majority of listeners who pay for their books (rather than choosing to listen to Librivox productions) expect a high quality performance and a respect for the genre. And that means not using the genre as a training ground and understanding it’s particular demands if you do choose to take it on, just as you should with any genre. But they’ve too often been disappointed. Vicky and I are hoping to help change that.
Respectfully,
Karen White
Great article and it was a truly great workshop as well, one of the best I’ve ever attended. Looking forward to next year in Chicago already!
Thanks Dawn for stopping by!
It’s taken me a bit to find the time to devote to sit down and read this. I was fascinated by the discussion. Thank you so much Karen, for including us in the preparation and then coming back and telling us about the workshop. I’d actually be fascinated as a listener to sit in the back of one of those workshops you know (not that it’s ever likely to happen given I’m in Australia, even if it were allowed!).
I’m blushing a little and laughing that you used my comment at the workshop! How flattering and embarrassing (in a good way) at the same time. LOL.
Thanks to you Kaetrin, and to the other AudioGals, for the time you took to write to me with your thoughts. They were all very helpful and enlightening. Your quote, when I read it at the workshop, got the kind of laugh that comes from recognizing truth. But it was also articulated in a very funny way, which made it fun to “narrate”!
*blushes more* thx Karen!